> but how often does that really happen?
> PennyPenny

All the dang time... As amazing as it seems, I have learned that few plastic boxes
are actually watertight. They leak with appalling frequency. That's why every one of
my logbooks has two (count 'em, TWO) baggies around it and I often add an extra
bag to logbooks I find.. I've decided the real function of the box is to protect the
plastic bags from damage. In addition, animals chew the boxes, they crack in cold
weather and folks sometimes fail to seal them correctly.

I feel the same as Warrior Woman regarding pigment ink: love it! I, too, have had
logs from my boxes get wet. Those blank pages where a dye image used to be are
most disappointing. Plus, just try to color a large stamp on a hot, windy desert
afternoon with dye based inks. The stuff dries way too fast for that situation. It's a
study in frustration to even try. Funhog

PennyPenny,

Choose your hiding spot wisely. Boxes that get messed up fast are those that are hidden
in unfavorable locations. Something to do when considering a spot: if you were a
chipmunk, would you hide there to get out of the rain? Conversely, if you were an
amphibian, would you go swimming there after the rain?

These things get wet because they're outside. The thing to avoid is placing your
letterboxes where water will collect (or rise up and snatch the box away!).

The box you use can make all the difference in the world, too. Some people swear by the
Milan Classics containers available at Linens'n'Things. I swear by the blue-rimmed
Rubbermaid containers. And genuine Ziploc freezer bags (without the zipper handle).

The lifespan of a box depends on its hiding spot (which involves many more variables than
just water), the container, internal protective measures, and how well it is RE-hidden by
Finders. And luck. Some boxes are born unlucky and some have nine lives.

_SteveS

--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, C&K wrote:
> placer (I'm on my second,) I'm wondering two things: 1) Should I expect
> my newly placed letterbox to get messed up pretty quickly (another
> topic could be, 'what is the average life of a box?') and 2) Why is it
> exactly that many of these boxes actually get wet at all? I mean,

> PennyPenny
> South Lyon, MI

I've been letterboxing/geocaching for exactly one
year. I'll toss my opinions on these questions:

--- C&K wrote:

> 1) Should I expect
> my newly placed letterbox to get messed up pretty
> quickly

Depends what you mean by "messed up" and "quickly".
In general, I suspect the average life span of a
letterbox is less than three years, but it varies from
one afternoon to as long as LbNA has been online.

Having FOUND a great many letterboxes and geocaches
gives one some idea what holds up long-term and what
doesn't:

Baggies on the OUTSIDE of the container are almost
totally worthless; the best you can hope for is that
they'll keep some of the dirt off the box so the
finder doesn't get his hands as dirty opening it up --
but he probably won't put the ripped-up baggie back on
when he's done, so all you've done is made litter.

Genuine military-style ammo boxes hold up well and
protect everything inside an order of magnitude better
than anything else. Unfortunately, they also bring in
the occasional terrified phone call to the bomb squad.

Plastic food containers are all over the map, but
easily the best are the relatively new "Lock-N-Lock"
brand. Simply superb. Genuine Tupperware is easily
the worst, throw that stuff away. I find Glad
containers work OK, not great.

Various large-mouth screw-top plastic jars such as
mayonnaise jars, peanut butter jars, cashew nut jars,
pretzel jars, trail mix jars, etc., are really good,
and cost nothing. The biggest problem is if the
opening is big enough for your log book. I usually
paint these jars with camo paint.

Whatever container is used, put anything that might
suffer if it gets wet inside a baggie INSIDE the
container. Provide a separate baggie for the log
book. Make sure the baggie is plenty large so that
the finder doesn't have to tug to get the log book in
and out of it -- it won't last. And, above all,
never, NEVER put the pen INSIDE the baggie with the
log book! There's no need to protect the pen from
water damage, and it just punches holes in the baggie
if it's inside it.

Carry lots of spare baggies to help maintain
letterboxes that you find. It's far better to simply
install a new baggie than to write the owner a note
saying a new baggie is needed.

I collect short pens. I've found several nice types,
but if you can't find any you can make some: just take
a stick pen and cut about an inch off the tail end.
This makes them fit in letterboxes much better.

After all this, letterboxes will still take hits. If
you use the wrong rubber to make your stamp, it'll rot
and fall apart. I found a superb custom stamp that
somebody had paid a commercial shop some big bucks to
make for him from a digital image, and it had
completely melted into a blob in a letterbox that got
sunlight on it. The pink stuff (Speedy-Stamp) is much
better, seems to hold up well.

Properly mounted on a layer of foam and a layer of
wood, a good rubberstamp seems to be more durable than
everything around it. Often the log book is a
complete disaster, but the rubberstamp is fine.

I've had some letterboxes chewed by dogs. They just
love to find such things, and I made the mistake of
hiding a letterbox in a park where people often walk
their dogs. The plastic container ended up all full
of tooth holes, while the rubberstamp inside was still
OK.

> 2) Why is it
> exactly that many of these boxes actually get wet at
> all? I mean,
> personally if I'm letterboxing and it's raining, I
> don't even touch the
> inside stuff until I'm safe under a shelter -- or at
> least my umbrella
> -- and have dried my hands off.

Easier said than done. When you've just hiked four
miles and it JUST started raining five minutes ago and
it's now coming down in buckets and you won't ever be
coming this way again, it's hard to convince yourself
to just put the letterbox back without opening it.

Having said that, though, I'm pretty sure I've never
gotten any significant water inside anybody's
letterbox. More often is the problem that the
container leaks, so it gets wet inside every time it
rains while it's sitting in its hiding place.





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